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Oldjimturbine

Ohlsson rice diesel

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Hello.  I have a couple of ohlsson rice .85 and 1hp engines, and watched a YouTube repair tutorial and mentioned that these engines could be converted to diesel.  Has anyone successfully converted these engines to a diesel?  Any pros or cons in a conversion?

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Are they getting confused with converting for running on RC glow fuel? Diesel would need a higher compression ratio. Also how would you lubricate the engine and would all the rubber seals be OK with diesel?

 

Have you got any pictures of you O&R engines?

 

David

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Thank you pmackellow and factory for the help and reply.  I'm new at this, I took apart my tiny tiger too soon, no knowledge and I damaged it.  I started researching the engine online with sites like these and YouTube.  I'm post retirement and just became interested and wanted to start with a small engine that I didnt think was too complicated.  I was wrong.  The other engine I recently purchased from eBay is supposed to be a 1hp military unused, but I'm not sure it is a 1hp because there is no documentation to support their claim, and the picture if one I saw in eBay is a lighter color, plus the exhaust filter if in correct, is larger on other 1hp than the one I purchased, so I dont know.  While watching YouTube, there was a 3 video dismantling of a 1hp oldsson rice, and he mentioned on the video that basically it is a large Olsson rice airplane engine and he mentioned about it being converted to diesel.   That's all I know in the subject and was looking to find out if someone has already done it, and had some type of cooling system added to it, and that compression wasn't an issue plus oil additive would be the lubricant like on other small diesel engines I read about.  I am going to start slow, try to reassemble the tiger first and replace what I broke in the learning process.

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Hi there,

 

Having worked with RC-engines for many years and having converted a couple from glow to diesel and the other way, I would consider converting an O&R engine pretty straight forward.

 

My biggest concern would be the roller bearings that are pretty tiny as they are and they will see much heavier load when running with the higher compression ratio. And then we have to see if the fuel lines and the diaphram in the carburettor is able to withstand Ether. It's an interesting project, but I wouldn't expect such an engine to have many hours in it ;-)

 

/Steen

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Wallfish and Webhead have some spare parts for these engines, hopefully they can sort you out with the part that got broken if it can't be repaired.

 

Is the unused Military engine a type 133? Quite a few of these have turned up over the past few years, I have never found out the intended use for them though (there is almost no trace on the web when I researched the military part numbers), I don't think they were spare engines for the military version of the Champ generator though as the mounting is different.

 

David

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Thank you factory and twin sport.  I broke many important pieces of the 3/4 generator during disassembly, one being the crank, lost some bearings which I may be able to find with a magnet but not sure if they will be usable if scratched, so I might need new bearings, I damaged the shaft that the magnet was connected to from the generator, and I would probably need a new shaft and magnet.  I don't know if that fuel tank is usable, if the fuel lines in the tank can be serviced, it seems to be one piece that doesn't disassemble.   Im not sure where to look for the type number yet, all I can say is it's either marine, who the former seller provides a copy of a marine 3/4 hp manual he advertised as military, but after a couple of messages says he doesn't know.  I will send some pictures, I have never seen a marine version in dark green, only red so I will send some pictures after I receive the green one I just purchased.  You might have already seen pictures of it on the internet, it was recently advertised as a 1hp military unit.  It was different, it looks like some paint was missing from the fuel tank, so I'm not sure it was painted either.  Maybe you saw it already and can provide me some info.

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:WMOM:

If Webhead doesn't have the parts you need, I may have some. I have some used crank shafts and parts from a damaged tiny tiger generator. Are you thinking you need the magnet part that spins inside the copper coils of the generator?

O&R engines come in many colors and green military is an original factory color.

Still always best to post pictures of what you have so we can better help. You can use a photo host like "photobucket" which is free and then copy and paste the img link and the photos will show on here. Or you can become a supporter for $10 and posting pics is easy as drag and drop them into your post.

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Thank you for the reply.  Yes, when disassembling the generator, I tried to separate the magnet from the shaft, and damaged the shaft, plus a corner of the magnet broke off.  Also, I would need the ball bearing from it to.  The motor I purchased was recently on eBay, and I haven't received it yet.  The photos of it on eBay, were a darker color green than the regular army green, but the number on the box in the picture was 2805-939-6818, and another number above the serial number was DAAK01-67-C-1182.  Not sure if that helps.

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Is the Military green O&R this one ?

 

Ohlsson & Rice Military Engine.jpg

If it is it's almost certainly a type 133 engine (that I mentioned in post 6) presumably sold as military surplus at some point, looks like a previous owner thought about using it for a model boat. The page with it is not a marine manual, it's a printout of the Octura ad that is on another website (I can't remember where it's from but I have it saved too).

 

You should send Wallfish pictures of the crankshafts needed for your Tiny Tiger, as there are different types depending on the age of the engine.

If you edit any pictures to reduce the file size you will be able to post a few pictures on this forum.

 

David

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Hello factory, and that's the engine I purchased, and just received it today.  I was surprised at how small the gas tank was, I always thought they were larger, it looks like a toy, but all the parts look new.  There is a notice on the engine that it's preserved, do not crank.  Does that mean it just needs oil, or did they add some chemical preservative?

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From what reading about preservation, I'm guessing there is some preservation oil in the engine itself, and the spark plug removed to pour it in there.  I haven't removed anything yet because I haven't started anything yet, and I'm interested in getting the tiny tiger running first, if that's possible.  If anyone reading, does that sound right, because it's military, Ohlsson rice, or the military poured preservation oil in the engine through the spark plug, and it has to be removed prior to cranking the engine?  Is there any special cleaning of the engine after this preservative is removed, or do you just empty it and put in fresh oil?

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Factory, I have the manual and put it away, but am looking for it, and I will be able to provide more information.  Right now I am using an iPad 1, the first one that came out with no camera, but for some reason, I can down load pictures, but having trouble sending pictures but will send pictures soon.  I can tell you it has the older style spark plug connector, the clip on version.

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14 hours ago, Oldjimturbine said:

From what reading about preservation, I'm guessing there is some preservation oil in the engine itself, and the spark plug removed to pour it in there.  I haven't removed anything yet because I haven't started anything yet, and I'm interested in getting the tiny tiger running first, if that's possible.  If anyone reading, does that sound right, because it's military, Ohlsson rice, or the military poured preservation oil in the engine through the spark plug, and it has to be removed prior to cranking the engine?  Is there any special cleaning of the engine after this preservative is removed, or do you just empty it and put in fresh oil?

 

A teaspoonful of oil poured into the cylinder is the standard procedure recommended by O&R for any engine that is going to be stored, even if only for a short time. The oil is then spread around by cranking the engine several times at various angles, also the piston should be stopped half way up the cylinder to block the exhaust ports.

 

There is a thread discussing preparing these engines for storage here;

Also see the challenger chain saw manual I posted here;

It's the later model 20A engine but the storage procedure is the same, see page 10,  It also mentions emptying the fuel tank before storing and running the engine till it stops to remove fuel mix from the lines & carb. When the engine is used again the preservative oil remains and causes blue exhaust that quickly diminishes.

 

David

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My broken tiger generator has an ohlsson rice 111 engine.  The connecting rod is broken, crankshaft ok, just missing the other half, still looking.  I believe I was trying to unscrew the head at the time, couldn't.  I thought at the time the engine was unrepairable, and parts not replaceable so I wasn't careful.  Also, the governor is bent, not sure that's salvageable, maybe.

Edited by Oldjimturbine

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It always ends badly if the cylinder is unscrewed with the piston stuck, if they don't turn over with the starter I usually put some oil down the spark-plug hole and after a week or so I remove the starter assembly & turn the flywheel to get them unstuck. I've also had a dried out PTO bearing on one engine preventing it turning over.

 

So far I've only had one stuck engine where the piston could not be freed, it was a Champ generator which I suspect didn't have any oil in the fuel & seized up. A previous owner had already broke the con-rod removing the cylinder & lost most of the bearings. I did eventually separate the piston from the cylinder by pressing it out using a vice, a scrap crankcase and a rod of metal, the piston came out without any further damage (only try this with 14mm spark-plug cylinders, 10mm types will result in holey piston), but I never did manage to separate the rings from the piston.

 

The early all metal governor vane does have a bend in the vane, if bent to the incorrect shape the shaft can fall out of the carb when running resulting in over speeding of the engine, I had this problem with my first engine, I did get it sorted with help from the forum.

 

The Pile-O-Bits Tiny Tiger I restored did originally have a Type 111 engine, an incomplete Type 98 engine of similar age was used for parts to replace the missing crankshaft, piston and cracked crankcase. Before and after pictures here;

David

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Hello again.  I recently saw a 1hp engine converted by a company to a glow engine.    For an rc toy.  The engine is gummed up as written by the seller, and I was interested in this one to tinker with, and post on this thread to find out if it could be repaired.  From the outside, all it looks like was that a glow plug is screwed into the spark plug socket.  If any modification to the inside, i guess i will need some help in identifying any changes.  If I win the bid, I will post pictures and ask for help in the disassembly of it if it is possible.  I will start slow with cleaning it.  My order question after seeing the tiny tiger rebuilt, was how do you clean these engines and make them look new?  

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Unless the engine is an Octura conversion, the only parts usually changed for RC use are the carb and spark to glow ignition.

Early engines can be more tricky to find parts for, but for the later ones parts are easier to find, apart from tanks and the cooling baffle plates for the cylinder which are often missing.

 

For cleaning I usually clean the oil & dirt off with petrol (gas) using various old brushes (check they don't dissolve in the fuel first) for the cast alloy parts. I prefer to keep the original paint if it's not in bad condition.

Steel parts that are rusty are cleaned with wire brushes/wheel and oiled after. I have looked into blueing/bluing kits for getting them looking like new, but haven't tried any yet.

I don't currently attempt to clean corrosion from the alloy parts as I don't like the scratched finish that results from using wire brushes on softer alloy parts. Unless they have been left outside or somewhere damp they usually aren't corroded. The exception is the Turbair sprayer where the pesticide chemicals used seem to corrode everything. There are specialist companies out there offering vapor blasting that can make alloy parts look better (such as carbs/alloy covers for classic car & bike engines), no idea what it would cost though.

 

David

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Once converted to glow plug, there is no need for the coil, condenser, points. If used for an airplane, the flywheel can be removed to.

I have another one too but never posted anything on it. Here are are a couple threads with glow plug engines.

 

I use old toothbrushes, Q-tip swabs and a brass wire brush to clean them. And anything else I can find along with lots of paper shop towels

 

 

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Thank you again, you o&r guys are very knowledgeable on these engines, and I don't know how you find out about the specific model and type numbers, I can find very little, other than pictures and YouTube.   The rc toy is a helicopter, and the engine can easily be swapped with a gas engine if needed.  If I win the auction, that will be the first engine I take apart, and this time carefully.  One more question:  is there any aftermarket electronic starting and ignition circuits for the 1hp to reduce weight?

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Not that I know of. Go with the glow fuel conversion to reduce the weight.

If there's enough air flow to cool it, maybe the flywheel can be removed but a smaller lighter pulley or something can be added to start it with a rope.

OR, maybe have the flywheel machined to be lighter but still use the fins, starter pawls and recoil housing?

Just kind of throwing stuff out there for some options.

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On 2/18/2017 at 0:32 AM, Oldjimturbine said:

Thank you again, you o&r guys are very knowledgeable on these engines, and I don't know how you find out about the specific model and type numbers, I can find very little, other than pictures and YouTube.

 

A few of us have one of the repair shop service manuals, which contain a lot of info including parts lists & diagrams for the engines & some tools and the engine maintenance instructions, most of the repair shops didn't bother paying for the yearly updates though so some info is harder to find.

 

David

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I just purchased this engine, missing recoil, flywheel, tank, and other parts, has another carb for rc control, a fuel port( I think ), and  different shafts front and rear, I'm guessing for an airplane, but I would like an opinion on what it needs to attempt to start it.   It turns but I dont have any lubricating oil yet so I don't want to turn it till its lubricated first.  I will start with these photos, and will be adding photos of the military and red 1hp engines I have.

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