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Honda MadTrax V Twin Quad.. Chop n changing..

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Still no luck getting the rear diff out, but I did take the input shaft out to try and see what's going on inside..
No diff inside but both cogs look in great shape.









Getting drive from the Honda bike gearbox was always going to be fun as there isn't much space!





The only thing I could do was move the transfer box as far back as possible.
So out came the Quadzilla battery tray, followed by a slice taken out of a rear strut tower.







The transfer box/rear diff coupler limits how far box the TB (transfer box) can be moved back.





But notch cut out of the strut tower allowed me to move the TB back a good 1/2 inch.. Not much but it all helps.





At this point I still didn't have a working Mig welder and couldn't really do any more on the project, so I tidied the bench and had a think.





A change of plan getting the drive to the front er... I keep going to call them "diff's" but they dont have a diff in them!
Anyway, you know what I mean.
Rather than go the chain and sprockets way I meantioned in my last update, I will be using the Quadzilla drive shafts, all I need is one more UJ tyo get the shafts around the engine.
Of course the front part of the exhaust won't fit because of a drive shaft in the way, but hey, it's only metal 1f603.png





While on the subject of shafts, this is part of the drive shaft that fit's on the bike gearbox, the problem is the splines inside don't go all the way to the UJ, so I can't just cut it to length!
The only way to do it is to slice a bit out the middle and weld the splined section back on much closer to the UJ.
I need to shorten this so it will fit onto the gearbox splines and leave enough room for the UJ on the shaft that runs from the TB to the front axle.
To make it easier to line the two bits back up for welding I needed to machine the slined end to an even size outside.





As the UJ isn't designed to be taken apart (thanks for that Honda!) I had to be inventive and find a way to hold it all steady in the lathe.
It's been a long time since I've used a steady rest, but it did the job well and the machining went smoothly.






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A big thank you to Rex at this point for turning up at the workshop one day sporting a couple of massive MAN truck steering columns. Thanks mate 1f44d.png





I can't use two of the UJ's as they have a plastic center bit.

"I have since found out that the plastic bit is only a cover so I can use them"





But I can use the shafts and other UJ's (one of which is a double) to get the power from the GB (gearbox) to the TB input shaft... But more on that when I get to sort it.





With my Murex TradeMig finally fixed I decided to celebrate and make some mounts for the TB.
Two of the mounts were cut off the remains of the Quadzilla frame which gave me a good start.
Space is so tight getting the TB in and out of the frame I have to make all the mounts removable from the frame so they don't get in the way!
I welded on a couple of captive nut before welding this bit to the frame.
Once the TB has been taken out again I can fully weld it up.





MMmmm, some nice strong welds 1f603.png





This bracket bolts the TB to the frame, but I didn't like the look of it.





So the corners were sliced off.





And some new metal was added to put the strenth back in the bracket.
Will you look at those pretty colours, yep I'd say my Mig is now working better than ever and producing the heat it needs to do a very strong weld 1f603.png





That looks better..





The TB mount the other side. Nice and strong (well it will be when I can fully weld it up when the TB comes out), but I'm not sure I like the shape of it so a few mods will need to be done.







That will do for now, it's given you all plenty to read :D


More to come later..

17 minutes ago, Stormin said:

Sounds to me you could be right about things being welded up. Maybe a half shaft broke at sometime. I think you'll need to split the box.


The trouble is I can't split the box with it in the frame, and I can't get it out!


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On 25/10/2017 at 6:12 PM, ranger said:

If you're going to use those steering shafts for drive shafts, how about balance? Those clamping thingy's look a bit offset.


Well spotted :)

The off-set bits of the UJ's will be ground down to make them..er... Not off-set :lol:

As I will be grinding off the bits where the clamping bolts go I will need another way of making sure the UJ's don't come off the shafts..

On the Quadzilla roll pins were used, so that would be the way to go I think..


The TB didn't officially have a mount around the input shaft I thought it might be wise to make one as a lot of forces will be going into the TB there..
A cardboard template taking shape, pencils being just the right size to screww into an M8 thread 1f600.png





As I didn't have a big enough bit of strong plate to make the bracket from I had to make it in two parts.





Two of the bolt holes on the TB didn't stick out as much as the other two, so to level things up a couple of spacers were added to the inside of the plate.





Welds cleaned up. The chain driller hole is slowly getting filed round. By doing it a bit at a time it breaks the bordom/arm ache up into managable bite sized chunks :lol: 





Bolted back on with a few extras.
The top right hand bolt bolts into a threaded tube thats welded to the strut tower.
As any "tabs with captive nuts" type things would get in the way of reoving the TB, I had to come up with another mounting spot.





Something like this..
It was also a good time to mark out a bolt hole.







Off with the bracket them slice the top off the foot rest mount..
Drill it, weld a captive nut inside then weld it all back onto the frame... Top mounting point sorted








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To get the drive from the Honda bike gearbox to the TB I had to find a way of turning the drive direction around by 90'd..

One of the steering UJ's fitted with the the splined section from the original CX/trike propshaft..





The shaft will run diagonally between the engine and TB with a nice meaty bearing to hold it in place.





And via this double UJ thingy the drive will come out the side of the frame through another meaty bearing and put the drive in the same orientation as the TB input shaft..





Working out space for the TB to front drive shaft.





Using a mixture of different shafts and UJ's there is plenty of space to run the front drive up the side of the engine.





Hhhmm... Maybe not quite the same size where they need to be joined!





A bit of lathe work later..





Ta-Daa :lol:





Not fully fitted together in this photo as I don't know the exact length yet, but you get the idea :)





Popping back around to the other side of MadTrax for a mo, the pulley (I will be using chain and sprockets) is about the right size to give me an idea how much space I need to create to fit a bearing in.





I need to slice some of the frame out here, but I planned to do that anyway to get rid of the un-needed swing arm mount.. It's the only bit left that says "I've welded a few extra tubes to a bike frame" :lol::D





The bearings arrived Wednesday but I've not had a chance to do anything with them.. That's fun for tomorrow :D



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On 25/10/2017 at 6:12 PM, ranger said:

If you're going to use those steering shafts for drive shafts, how about balance? Those clamping thingy's look a bit offset.


HI Doug, I've had another thought on the clamp thingys.. Rather than take metal off of one side to balance the UJ's, it would be better and stronger to add metal to one side and build it up with weld (making sure not to let things get too hot) until both sides match..



While waiting for the bearings to turn up, I thought I'd make a start on a sleeve to fit over the input shaft on the TB..

Not the best photo (I will get a better one) but here's the shaft in question.





The only bit of steel bar I have which is long enough is made from very hard steel and looks like it has been used to hold a JCB bucket on... That sort of hardness!

Anyway, I can make it in two parts and weld them together which would make it easier turning the tapered part half way down the shaft inside..

These two lumps I made years ago as pivot points for a dozer blade that was going to go on the 6x6..

A lot of turning to get them down to size!


At least one is mostly done :)





Woo Hoo... The bearings arrived :thumbs:

Here's the TB to front end bearing mocked in place..





Best start getting the bearings mounted then.. First up something to bolt them to.. Well, a couple of somethings..





Bolted on. The black bit of steel across the lower bearing bolts is just to keep the bearing square to each other.

You can just see where I welded on some tempoary bracing to the drive shaft to stop anything moving about withough the axle stand and other bits that were holding the bearings etc in place.





If you flip the bearings over you can see the captive nuts that have been welded on... Don't think they are going anywhere :lol::D





Now the fun bit.. Making four somethings to bridge the gap between the back of the bearings and the chassis/frame..





Starting with a bit of CAD (cardboard aided design) work.. :lol:





Which goes somewhere here.. Rather hard to hold it in place and take a farto at the same time!





Roughly cut out of steel..





That looks better.





Four of em made and tacked in place..





Bearings off..





Fully welded up... Almost..  It will be easier to weld the extreme top on bottoms where the brackets fit on the frame without the engine in and sump guard in place, so that can wait until stripdown time.





Welds ground down, a nice curve at the back to clear the engine.





And most importantly, there is still plenty of UJ clearance here..





And here :thumbs:





And to finish off this update, a photo of the bearings etc quickly bolted on for this very photo.. The mounts were still very hot from welding and grinding so I didn't want the bearings sitting getting hot for too long..



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Not much to report, Monday was spent arguing with a car radio, and yesterday my knees were so bad I was only in the workshop for a little while..


But I did manage to get the front driveshaft welded up..





I don't think the welds are going to break :D





Almost forgot, the latest MadTrax video... Enjoy :thumbs:



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Great workmanship and thought going into this project Ian, grand job. :thumbs:

I hate to say this but, :hide: in the photo of your driveshaft, it looks like the shaft yokes are out of phase.

All shafts I've had dealings with, (apart from steering shafts installed at high angles, which don't spin at high speed), always have the shaft inner yokes in line to aid in cancelling out vibrations, not a problem if the whole assembly runs in a dead straight line, but when angles are involved?

Not a criticism , just an observation . You don't want that coming adrift at any speed close to your leg The ideal perhaps, would be a pair of CV joints, if there's room.



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