Tom 215 #26 Posted May 25, 2015 Tom 4 meadowfield, pmackellow, nigel and 1 other reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #27 Posted May 25, 2015 Hi Tom, I wondered if it was something made and fitted over here aswell as I have looked all over the Internet and can't find one like it anywhere, at least I'm sure it isn't a homemade thing anymore Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #28 Posted May 25, 2015 It's certainly interesting, we will have to watch out for anymore. Correct me if I'm wrong but you have a wheel horse plough don't you? Does that fit your Cub? I ask as the clevis part seems quite wide to me, too wide for a brinly plough. Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #29 Posted May 25, 2015 Unfortunately last week I sold my Wheel Horse with the plough, it wasn't a wheel horse plough but I modified it to fit the clevis hitch, to me it looks like it would have fit the Cub but I'll see whether my dad's plough will fit it. Here was the plough, Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #30 Posted May 25, 2015 Sorry to see that you had to sell it, I did see it sell however and glad you got a good price. It will be interesting to see if your dads plough fits the cub! Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #31 Posted May 25, 2015 It will be a while until I can see if it fits as I have removed my hitch on the cub but I will measure the clevis on the plough and see if it would fit the CC lift. Ewan 1 HeadExam reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HeadExam 1,783 #32 Posted May 26, 2015 It will fit, but you need the bottom bracket with the lift straps that hook to the center lift Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #33 Posted May 26, 2015 Had the engine on the bench today and inspected further into it. Not great news unfortunately, bearing plate is broken on the side; I'm presuming where someone has tried to lever the flywheel off. The flywheel is cracked, again I imagine due to harsh treatment, the magneto also seems to be not working. I tried an OHM test with no results so I'm not sure how else to try it. It makes sense because someone has put a coil on the side of it which makes me think they didn't or couldn't replace the magneto so just tried a coil to get it to work. They have also tried a new condenser. I'm unsure what to do now, I want to keep it original as possible BUT at the same time don't want to spend heaps of money getting all the original parts because like all my other tractors it will be a worker. The best thing would be to get a donor engine but I can't see that happening really.. Any help or advice would be appreciated! Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #34 Posted May 26, 2015 Tom, Is it a 7hp kohler engine if it is then you probably won't find another one easily, I know someone that has a cub cadet 70 that swapped a 7hp kohler with an 8hp, could that be a solution? Ewan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #35 Posted May 26, 2015 Hi Ewan, It's a possibility as long as the bolt pattern is the same on the sump and I can put the recoil on the 8hp as well as the tank and the drive pulley. It's definitely achievable though, the next problem is finding a nice running 8hp, unless you've got one? Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #36 Posted May 26, 2015 Hi Tom, Well the person that I know that did it said that it bolted straight in, unfortunately I don't have one but I've being looking on that auction site and there was one on the other day that sold, I'd just keep looking on there if I were you or ask around, someone may have one kicking around Ewan Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Charlie Smith 192 #37 Posted May 26, 2015 Tom, my original doesn't have the original 7 hp kohler, it has the 8 hp kohler the k181 I never done the engine swap but it bolted straight on with the same holes no need for modifications Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #38 Posted May 26, 2015 Hi guys, Were the K181s electric start? I imagine so as the 7hp Cub recoil wouldn't fit an 8hp I don't think as it has dowels to help keep it in line, maybe I will have to convert it to electric start too.. They don't make it easy! Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Charlie Smith 192 #39 Posted May 26, 2015 My K-181 is electric start yes, but not sure if they also did recoil starters? someone with a bit more knowledge will have to tell you that, but i can reassure you that the K-181 will fit without any modifications. here is a few pics of the k-181 on it and the mounting holes when i removed it for spraying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #40 Posted May 26, 2015 (edited) Hi Tom, Kohler made the K-181 with electric start but you can also get them with recoil starters, the picture below shows a k-181 with a recoil starter. Edited May 26, 2015 by Cub Cadet Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #41 Posted May 26, 2015 Hi guys, Thanks for your continued help. I'd prefer a recoil really, it's less to go wrong in my opinion. If I did replace the engine I'd like to try and rebuild the original engine and eventually stick it back in. Apparently the recoils are quite uncommon. I know Iains is also a recoil start. I'm definitely going to have to look out for a replacement I think, it's going to be expensive gaining all the parts and in the mean time I can look out for a 7hp. The only thing that worries me is fitting the drive pulley on the flywheel side of the engine, I'm not sure if the Cub kohlers were made any different to other kohlers? Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chris 642 #42 Posted May 26, 2015 Would a kohler off a howard 350 fit?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #43 Posted May 26, 2015 I would imagine so, from what I've read the K141, K161 and K181 are very similar apart from bore size. The 350s run a K141 originally... I was actually thinking of them because they are fairly common, the main downside is they come with the rest of the machine most of the time! Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #44 Posted May 26, 2015 Chris, in theory I think it should. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HeadExam 1,783 #45 Posted May 26, 2015 Well in theory one might think so, but that is DEFINITELY not the case. For example, Kohler made dozens of different models each of the k series 10, 12, and 14 hp engines, the 14 hp K321 alone had over 75 different crankshaft applications. To correctly replace any kohler engine you need to match up the SPEC number, that will tell you if it has the right crankshaft, carburetor, starter, oil pan, air breather, and weather it is alternator, generator or battery or magneto ignitions. if you do your homework it will save you from sorrow down the road, if you don't do your homework your shed will turn into the local spares store. BTW, I have a list of spec numbers, crankshaft cross references and such. On a final note, the spec numbers don't always have to match exactly, some overlap in application, some. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slf-uk 914 #46 Posted May 27, 2015 I've experienced the fun of Kohler spec numbers whilst ordering parts for the K582 in my Bolens HT23. I've just had another look at your pictures of the damaged parts and I think it would be possible to do a weld repair. For the flywheel I would suggest farming that out to someone experienced with welding cast because you really don't want it to fall apart with the engine running. You may have someone at work who would do it for the cost of a drink. The K161 I have on my bench (that we were looking at on Saturday) has the complete center of the flywheel broken off. The previous owner had glued it back in place and used the engine until the glue gave way, so a good weld repair should work well although it may be slightly out of balance. Before doing that it might be worth finding out if mechanically the engine is sound. We could pull the flywheel, mag, etc. from the K161 on one of my ride-a-matics's to try to get your engine running. Iain Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #47 Posted May 28, 2015 Well in theory one might think so, but that is DEFINITELY not the case. For example, Kohler made dozens of different models each of the k series 10, 12, and 14 hp engines, the 14 hp K321 alone had over 75 different crankshaft applications. To correctly replace any kohler engine you need to match up the SPEC number, that will tell you if it has the right crankshaft, carburetor, starter, oil pan, air breather, and weather it is alternator, generator or battery or magneto ignitions. if you do your homework it will save you from sorrow down the road, if you don't do your homework your shed will turn into the local spares store. BTW, I have a list of spec numbers, crankshaft cross references and such. On a final note, the spec numbers don't always have to match exactly, some overlap in application, some. Hi HeadExam, I fully understand what you are saying and have noticed many small differences in the Kohlers I have owned. The spec number I have for this engine is: 23493E if that is any help to you.. The only problem I can see me having if I were to put a K141/K161/K181 would be fitting the drive pulley and recoil for the drive belt. I'm not too sure if the other Kohlers would have a hole for the dowel on the pulley.. Tom I've experienced the fun of Kohler spec numbers whilst ordering parts for the K582 in my Bolens HT23. I've just had another look at your pictures of the damaged parts and I think it would be possible to do a weld repair. For the flywheel I would suggest farming that out to someone experienced with welding cast because you really don't want it to fall apart with the engine running. You may have someone at work who would do it for the cost of a drink. The K161 I have on my bench (that we were looking at on Saturday) has the complete center of the flywheel broken off. The previous owner had glued it back in place and used the engine until the glue gave way, so a good weld repair should work well although it may be slightly out of balance. Before doing that it might be worth finding out if mechanically the engine is sound. We could pull the flywheel, mag, etc. from the K161 on one of my ride-a-matics's to try to get your engine running. Iain Hi Iain, It may be an idea, and one that I have thought of. The only thing I would be worried about is would it unbalance the flywheel? I know you wouldn't be adding much weight.. That's a very kind offer of you which I may take you up on as, like you say, I don't want to throw sums of money at it and find out there is something else wrong! We will have to have a chat at the weekend Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cub Cadet 613 #48 Posted May 31, 2015 (edited) It's certainly interesting, we will have to watch out for anymore. Correct me if I'm wrong but you have a wheel horse plough don't you? Does that fit your Cub? I ask as the clevis part seems quite wide to me, too wide for a brinly plough. Tom Sorry about the bad angles, the plough is buried but it does fit the CC hitch, here are some pictures. Edited May 31, 2015 by Cub Cadet Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #49 Posted June 1, 2015 Thanks for that Ewan, I appreciate it. It's good news also, handy to know Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tom 215 #50 Posted June 1, 2015 Hi all, Not done much on the Cub lately, unfortunately. However, I have picked up some new rear tyres and another K161 engine. Admittedly it is seized but it has been barn stored and looks fairly straight so I can use parts off of it all being well. Has anyone else put 23-8.50 x 12 tyres on a cub before? I mocked it up and I quite like it, not sure what to put on the front though... What do you guys think? Tom Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
