Anglo Traction

Had a chance to do more on this monster yesterday and thought I'd keep up the progress on it as this thread gets picked up on a Google search for this Model and there is virtually zero information on it anywhere. This is actually a 1980 model, not an early 70s I believed it to be. Anyway, Pulled all the Clutch/Drive Unit out as it was seized. Brought the plates back with me to check and clean up. Condition is very good and little used, but just a very little rust pitting or discolouration from non use on the faces- Original Friction Material is still well bonded and virtually unworn, bronze bushings are good. I'm impressed with the size and quality of these Heavy Duty parts and appear to be able to cope with a lot of hard work. Roller chain is perfect and left to soak over night and so will be cleaning and reassembling the underside today.

I 'm hoping that is the case Wristpin (welcome). I have done some searching and there are Blades available that have the correct fixing spacing and number of holes, as well as dimensions. Just the profile to match. Also found the (possible) part number stamped on the Blade carrier (30397). So when the Mower's Parts and Instruction Manual arrives in the next few days, I'll hopefully have resolved that part. Old blade look's like it can be reground to a good edge. Pics to follow soon.

Hold on to the S12 as well for now Paul. I will be stripping the one out I have to rebuild it, so I'll see if I can make the part you mention. Float could be repaired too if just a pin hole or available still?. Also - Chris thanks for noticing both our S12 needs, despite us missing the boat on the Parts.

Ditto. Very impressive job and I really like the look of those Scythes. Maybe I'll find one to do one day.

Good news on the running improvements Norm. I take it the old Carb was a Walbro?. Also , just wondering what the state of the Air Filter is like?. They can also really screw up your mixtures and settings if they are dusty or Oiled .

Thanks for the Ad Paul, I wasn't surprised it claims it deals with tall paddock type grass volumes, and now I've seen it, I understand how it can cope with tall grass etc. Yes Ian it does and that Air Cleaner is the old 'Coopers' Oil Bath type. Bit of an update on this- Dashed down Wednesday afternoon to Lychett Matravers in Dorset to see my old buddy Roly, with over night stay planned and to help with some Wheel Horse work (Oh and finally delivered the Solid Engine Mounts Ian ) and to pick this Mower up. Plans all went to pot and ended up with 2 more of his mates turning up in a Light Aircraft at his local Airfield and also staying the night involving a Pub and Beers. No time next morning either due to playing with Aircraft and left for home 1130 due stopping off at Nomansland on the way to briefly visit Andy (wheeledhorseman). Thanks for the great tour Andy, you have a great place there and would love to visit again for longer. Then finally stopping off at Billingshurst on way home. Place has now been sold, so have to get moving with the machinery down there as well. Any road up, Roly managed to locate the Grass collector for it and is still complete and perfectly useable. It now has a positive ID- It still has the Atco Makers Brass Tag Plate on it. It's a 24" Side Wheel Mower (SH4, not an SF9 20") and dated 1957/58, which confirms the original purchasers date of 1958. I've uncovered a few improvised running repairs while giving it going over, here's one for example- Sheared screw that retains the Throttle Slide Cap and cable linkage, now held together by wire. not a problem to sort out. A missing Filter body screw and the other has damaged threads. Nothing looks impossible to deal with so far, although I suspect some corrosion in the Cylinder/Piston near the exhaust port, so will strip the engine and not attempt to turn it over. Bottom Blade is in 2 parts and a hefty 1/4" thick folded stiffener plate is good with a bolt on Blade that can be fabricated out of Carbon Steel if the original is no good. The reason why there appear to be so few of these early ones (late 50's) around could be due to the fact that the Cylinder Blades were apparently 'un-tempered' according to the Owner, as he had to get it weld repaired several times at an ATCO Dealer after they kept cracking/breaking in different places at least that's what he was told?. I still haven't seen any other early examples yet. This model had the heavy Hub Covers/Wheel retainers Chrome Plated- Anyway, I'm going to carry on with this and see how it goes. So my late Dad's Whitworth Spanners are back in service.

Thanks Gents, Fan arrived, didn't come from China in the end. Went and ordered it from here at 5 times the cost, but got it quicker and more solidly made. Made in Canada so still in the Commonwealth. Has an insert Bushing that can be bored to size. Came with a 17mm hole, so I had to bore it out to 24mm- These fans are made to fit a certain motor Frame size, so easy to order what you need. Fits perfik- The original German standard Schuko (CEE7/4) style double Socket fitted on this has never been used. Only the long extension which has UK 3pin socket on the end was used. IP Rating seals are all very good and so very clean inside- So I decided it will stay original, as there are lots of Fly lead adaptors available that link to Camping connectors etc and would be handy for people who travel to mainland Europe for Hols etc. Will fire it up to see if it all works when I collect and check the rest of the extension cable next week.

So you've inverted the Frame ......................... to make space for a taller motor ?. Will you still get a deck under it?.

Sorry, not sure how I missed this. Yes, I obtained mine from U.S. in the end, could not get the heavy duty Heim brand. Got mine (4) in 2012 for about £3 ea incl shipping. As Doug(Ranger) has mentioned above, now cost more, but if you still want them, I can point you to an advert for 4 at about £15 incl Shipping. Toro part number is 110513,but there are many U.S Aftermarket numbers too. Regards

Nice machine you have there Martin, I like the Scythes, well worth it when you find one that has been properly cared for. They are worth the extra cost. Hot running is an indicator for a dirty Carb leaning the fuel out as you've already sussed out . Surprised the previous owner left it like that.

Not sure where on the Shaft you have taken the measurement (Smooth part of shaft or across the O/D of the splines), 21.36mm converts to 0.8409" and the nearest fraction (over) that size is 27/32" (0.8437"), suspect also being central European make, it will be metric . I have no idea where you could find a likely replacement, but may be worth researching to see if the gearbox type/design was also used on other machinery as well. If you have no luck with a replacement, a good machine shop can accurately grind the O/Dia down, weld it, heat shrink and weld a sleeve on to re-establish the O/D and the Oil Seal faces. You can also obtain Shaft Sleeves that act as a new running face for the Oil Seal e.g. www.sealmasters.co.uk. It is also most likely the Crack will have to be cut/cleaned right through into the Spline groove, as I can see in your pic that the Crack is full of corrosion and expanded the piece making the shaft splines a 'looser' fit in the bore than is desirable . I imagine having a new one Broached will be OTT on cost. So there are ways to repair it. Hope you get It sorted whichever way you choose.

Thanks Ian & Mark. Hope it's worth it and does what it's supposed to do when it's all back together. Engine back in the cleaned up Frame with new Anti Vibe mounts and nice shiny Red Generator mated up again. Wiring has been checked and all connections were very good, but cleaned anyway, as is the 10metres of heavy duty cabling and 3 pin Dura Plug (Made in England). Preserved the Decal and markings with lacquer. Just the cooling fan to arrive and finish off now- Should be done in a few weeks.

Nice find and good little tool Paul, As Paul mentioned above, a coincidence, and you are fortunate to have the User and Parts Manuals available online still. Age will be between 68 and 87, depending on the Switch type fitted. Units sent to England were sold with 25 feet of cable.

Nice proper old Machine you have there Martin. D.R.G.M. - stands for Deutsches Reich Gebrauches Muster and yes It's pre WW2 German. The Motor was replaced/fitted in the 60s (after 1962) Here's a link to some information for you- http://www.lathes.co.uk/glass/

Hi Sten, I see your desperation is still unrewarded. I have a possible source for you. I'll send you a PM.

I wondered what all the traffic noise was as the London to Brighton Mini Run was on yesterday and some didn't sound like Minis. They all pass my place in Horley, as I'm only 80yards off the A23 (Great position for the Veteran Car Run). Nice pic Chris.

That's a pity, nice project that one. Suppose you've been seduced by S1g's opening Post pic. Have you decided what you want yet?

Yep, thanks, familiar with those specs. Problem with BS46 is that it is not as comprehensive a list of available sizes compared to the US ANSI B17.2 1967 specs #811 on that list is one of the sizes Wheel Horse used (1/4 x 1 3/8"). Tempted to go for 1/4" square and cut a long slot in the Shaft when I get to make them. I still have my old Key Steel Stock from the early 80s to fall back on. The softer ones on my tired C-120 Tranny are holding well, despite pulling a few Wheelies off the Clutch. Whatever you can produce in the way of Testing info would be greatly appreciated. Regards.

That's interesting Ranger and out of curiosity, I just dug the 1.3/8" Woodruffs out of my early 80s 103916 Tranny and checked them. They are as you say... harder than the soft 1" ones I took out of my early 70s 5091 8spd?- Would be very helpful if you can hardness check an Axle over it's length, as I would like to make some 1.1/8" dia once I establish that, Steel grade and the Module size for the Spline Cutter. I would have to pay a Local Engineering Shop for the testing and final Heat Treatment . Regards

Hi Ranger, I went down the road of making my own from Free Cutting Mild Steel . One thing you need to double check is that I don't think the Keys should be the same grade as Key Steel. They should be Mild Steel in order for the keys to shear before the Keyways on the Shafts and Hubs do (we all know they don't). The originals I removed were definitely only mild steel. Your call really. I'm still hoping to get time to break into my spare WH Tranny and get the Shafts Hardness Tested, but I suspect they are only about Rockwell 27, so pretty soft compared to Auto Drive shafts.

Revisited this machine about 3 weeks ago when I had some time, wanted to get the Carb off for a service before trying to run it. Found that someone had tried to get it running in my absence . They laid it up on it's opposite side (Carb/Exhaust down) and I found the Carb, Filter and cylinder filled with Oil !!!. Worse still, the fuel they put in just ran straight into the Crankcase via the Breather pipe because there was something wrong with the Float or Valve. All this has set me back a few weeks getting it sorted. 'Any Road Up' , I had to find and order a full Carb Rebuild kit and a new Air Filter. Cleaned it up and stripped the real dirty Carb to find that the Float had been eaten away probably by the 'Galvanic' process- Never seen one this bad, so I had to find one of those as well !. So I'm now back to where I started, but now have a nice clean rebuilt Large Flo-Jet Briggs Carb- Doing the Clutch, Drive and Blades next week and a test cut hopefully. then It' s clean up the framework etc. Should be a good machine when done.

Hi Jon, and welcome. Very nice project you have there and a good reason to restore it as it was your Father's. I know little of Gutbrod, suffice only to say that the 1030 was 12hp and fitted with a M.A.G Engine......if that is what is fitted to yours?. The only place I know that might have Engine parts for them is http://www.meetens.co.uk they are very helpful. It's good to hear that your attempting to use correct original parts where possible. Look forward to seeing your progress.

Hello Rob, I believe you are having problems with the pull start clutch engaging that is preventing you from starting the engine?, as you say that when it does engage, the engine starts easily. I've just finished a 4hp version upper end rebuild in the 1972 Genset Post above that has some pics of it. Your engine is a 1975 13 cu inch Alloy Engine (5 hp ish) . The rewind Starter Clutch has 6 ball bearings inside it and drop into segments (by gravity) as it rotates when you pull the Cord. It is not doing that now for some reason. You can remove the whole Cowling (3 bolts) with the Rewind unit attached, and remove the 2 little hex head screws that hold the Perforated mesh Screen to the Clutch unit on the Flywheel. The Clutch unit acts as the Flywheel nut and is tightened to 60 ft lbs, so if your very careful, you can leave it in place and prise open the Clutch plate from the rest of it to inspect the inside. Be very careful and ready to catch the 6 Ball Bearings, as they will probably (should) drop out. Clean out the whole unit and re-assemble it dry. If you can't get the Bearing Balls to remain in place during re-assembly, apply a very small amount of oil or light grease to retain them in place while you refit the outer cover, then lightly tap back in place and finish re-assembly. If the Clutch is chewed up and needs replacing, they are available on the Auction sites as ' Briggs and Stratton Starter Clutch' and will quote the part number in this diagram- Let us know how you get on, or if you need further assistance, as it may help others. Note also that Bolt head sizes are imperial and not metric. Hope this helps. Regards.

Yeah , it is a bit on the bright side Koen......... even brighter now ! Engine finished, except for finish cleaning up the Muffler- (click images to enlarge if req'd) Rewind Starter spring end needed repairing and works perfect now. Had the wiring out of the connection box on the Generator today to look for anything obvious. Found some corrosion, but nothing significant, so going to check all the cables out. I'm going to put this all back as a Generator and see if I have any luck. Found a replacement cooling fan which should do the job properly, but has to come from china !!!, also need 2 anti-vibe mounts, as found a few cracks in them. The Cradle will get a quick clean and paint, may put some transport/lock wheels on too.

Another Sussex Born here too. Still frequent the County(s). Often down in Billingshurst. W Sx .