The Yard-Arm uses a Type 184 (radial mount) engine, the clutch drum in that engine should have a keyway in it for the drive shaft, the Yard-Arm parts list doesn't give the part number for the rear housing but it looks different as it has to fit the drive tube, that said unless one appears we don't know if there could be an older version that uses a different engine Type.
The Model L was one of the standard engine range, available for anyone to buy & fit to whatever tool or application they could think of, the Type 99 & Type 199 are the later direct drive engines with clutch.
I have since acquired a Type 106 engine with the clutch assembly fitted, no idea if it's original yet (engine is sn 052178).
You shouldn't have too much difficulty in finding an incomplete parts Tiny Tiger in the US where they are most common, the only problem might be finding a seller that will ship to Canada.
These very early engines use different shafts to the later ones, I do have one very incomplete parts engine of this age, I will need to check which shaft it uses.
I also have an early Model L, sadly missing the rear section of the clutch housing.
I have an Octura engine with the high performance rotary valve installed in my White Heat, instead of the feather valve. It makes the engine sound much meaner and probably increases power output. That would be a pleasant surprise if yours has one. David, have you ever seen any paperwork on the rotary valve?
I don't actually have much paperwork for anything to do with Octura except a leaflet from a UK reseller of them, that doesn't mention the special rotary valve. Does it look similar in design to the rotary valves used on the older O&R model plane engines (before the Compact engine existed)?
David
P.S. just ordered an Octura 1965 catalog featuring the O&R powered White Heat, will see if that has anything in it when it arrives from the US.
The 1965 Octura catalog arrived today, the main catalog doesn't have anything O&R in it, but the extra newsletters, leaflet & the price list does.
The Octura rotary valve is mentioned as being available in 1966, other modifications mentioned for boosting performance include throwing away the governor vane & the ball valve mechanism from the carb, boring out the carb (this requires a making a new butterfly throttle) and different fuel mixes.
Also sold by Octura in the US was the Sea Queen boat kit, imported from Aerokits in England.
When I was looking through the early service information (1961) a few days ago, I noticed something very similar for unscrewing the cylinder, for some reason the socket is described as being 3/32" thick, which is clearly wrong (tool #11 in list).
The later manual mentions a different tool, which is very easy to make, I find a using a crescent wrench (adjustable spanner) is better than the flimsy bar (or ruining a screwdriver as mentioned in the manual) and the engine can be held in a vice using soft jaws (to prevent marking the crankcase).
I've found a good used set of points, the coil is a problem at the moment, all the parts engines seem to have faulty (intermittent wiring) or damaged coils.
I'm going to order some HT cable and see if I can repair some of them, as NOS are unobtainium.
With the information I posted with the letter from August 1960 for the first brochure, it mentioned that the three gearbox models were not yet available but would be in production soon, so that sort of dates your very early gearbox engine to sometime between the end of 1960 and early 1961, the next set of parts diagrams date from August 1961 (only two piston rings were used by then).
And looking at the gears fitted, this engine looks to be a Model H (1700 R.P.M. with clutch).
I should probably explain, this unusual early engine with gearbox was on ePay about 3 years ago, unfortunately I couldn't bid (or even ask for more info/pictures) as the seller had the usual international buyer blocking, it was also payment in cash & collection only. You helped me by contacting the seller, but sadly they never replied, that one picture is all I have from the listing.
It's good to know the engine survived & has found a home with CNew, as it never sold on ePay & I really thought it had been lost for good.
They remind of the rubber belts used in tape players, but they would probably instantly turn to mush when exposed to gas/oil mix (the ones used in Philips products turned to sticky mush with age, gas/petrol is one thing that could remove the sticky mess left ).
I'm sure there must be suitable gas resistant seals like that available.
By the way I've been busy tonight converting 360MB of scans of the first O&R Compact Engine literature from August 1960 to a 5MB pdf, which is now available to download from the manuals thread (as it was all together I have left it together).
I may add the brochure on it's own to the appropriate section as well.
The cylinder/exhaust collector gaskets are only found as new-old-stock, I have been making my own using modern gasket sheet and a set of punches.The O-ring cylinder seal can be replaced with a modern one.
The end float on the crankshaft is fairly normal for these engines.
I've still got to locate a coil, the spares engine the starter came from is missing this and a few other bits.
Thanks for the picture showing the serial number, I can confirm the A-139-2 is the correct starter dog, this type was first used with the A-47-10 flywheel after serial number 015997 and for all later flywheels (except for the much later Series 13B & 20A engines).
Which points parts do you need? I'm assuming something broke as they normally just need cleaning & the gap re-setting.
There is one part no-one has mentioned that I cannot see on your engine (it's also missing from my Chug-A-Saw engine), that is the governor vane, do you need one of those?
That's a shame about the coil as they rarely fail, I've had the wire break inside the insulation before.
For reference, I checked the older style coil on my Chug-A-Saw, it measures approx 2.4kΩ, from memory the later style coils (made by Phelon) measure much higher at around 6kΩ.
Here are some pictures of the vertical gas/fuel tank used on the Chug-A-Saw, it is the same size as the oil tank.
I was going to suggest making a tank using coffee tins, but they are slightly bigger in diameter and won't fit the space available.
I have 4 of the 5-2 exhaust collector gaskets and 3 of the 5-9 packing band gaskets so if you need a set
that can be arranged.
Could you spare one of each of those? They would be very useful in finding the nearest equivalent in the UK, I have quite a few of the first 6000 engines here, including one that's been in bits for years as they were missing.
Not yet, it isn't actually dated but came with a letter dated August 1960, it's going to need adding, but it won't be tonight, it's very late here and I just stuffed up a post I was going to add in another thread.
Also I have noticed a problem/error with the 1961 parts diagram, it shows #5-2 & #33-2 pointing at the wrong items (they are swapped). Reading the descriptions below the diagram gives the correct names, the manual that came with the C/Saw has a correct version of the diagram.
The 1962 price list states items marked with ⃰ must be used on engines with serial number 006072 or under and on (early) engines without a serial number. It also states items marked with a double ⃰ (sorry MS character map lacks correct symbol) must be used on engines with serial number 013072 or under and on (early) engines without a serial number.
The exhaust collector gasket (arrowed in your picture) is #5-2 on the parts list, the manual states to "lubricate this gasket generously" to prevent it getting damaged when screwing the cylinder down. I suspect this is a thin section O-ring or square section ring that is slightly larger is diameter than the cylinder O-ring, I can't confirm which unless someone finds some NOS (I would be interested in some if they turn up too).
It also confirms two packing band gaskets, part #5-9 are used for both the cylinder seal & feather valve seal.
Note: the reed/feather valve assembly changes after serial number 006073 as do a lot of the gaskets & seals.
David
Edit: added picture from August 1960 parts diagram, which also shows the three piston rings found in CNew's early engine.
On a recent one I did I found someone also left out some of the exhaust spacers and gaskets.
There is no exhaust collector spacer used on this engine, the exhaust collector is wider than the newer ones.
@Wallfish I will double check the manual with parts lists that came with the C/Saw I bought, it covers 1961/62 and early engines with no serial numbers.
Is the serial number below #006072? It certainly looks like an early engine, there are two gaskets for the cylinder, one at the top of the exhaust collector part no. #5-2 (I think this maybe a rubber seal but can't confirm), the other below the exhaust collector is part #5-9 this is a rubber seal (exactly the same as the one for the feather valve).
Silly question, but what sort of tool do you use to get such precise cuts on your foam filters?
Not a silly question at all, many years ago I bought a NOS industrial punch kit (as shown below at the current price) for about a third of the normal price on ePay from a seller that clears stock from closed down companies;
Things to note about the above kit, the punches are all metric, it also includes the arm with cutter for other sizes.
The filters can be cut in one go, as some of the punches can be used together, this depends how close the two sizes are.
Thanks @Fishnuts2 that's why I mentioned it, as no one else had complained or mentioned problems with synthetic oil, the only other oil I tried (many years ago) was some crap sold by petrol stations & was intended for mopeds, it was horribly smoky compared with the Stihl oil (it never got near any O&R's).
I've just been reading the comments on a Norton motorbike forum, they also have problems with fuel lines getting dissolved by modern fuels, which can be a fire risk if it leaks all over a hot engine.
I have this stuff, comes premixed from STIHL , expensive but I wouldn’t mind buying it for the amount I would use them but i comes premixed at 50-1, no ethanol.
this is likely what David is talking about.
Yes that is similar to what I found when I searched for Alkylate pre-mix, the Stihl one also uses synthetic oil (the Ultra one), we had one member complain that their O&R overheated with the synthetic version, it would be interesting to hear if anyone else has had problems using it or not.
I've been using the red Stihl HP (mineral version) in my vintage 2-stroke engines, which was recommended to me by someone who uses chainsaws for a living and has a collection of vintage ones too.
I'm definitely going to look for a can of the non-mixed Alkylate fuel (advertised for 4-stroke engines) and mix it using the Stihl HP mineral oil at 32:1 for my O&R engines.
Most petrol stations in the UK have the pumps marked as having up to 5% ethanol (E5), but this will be increasing to 10% (E10).
Also the advice about taking out the air filter before starting an old O&R was huge. I gingerly took mine apart, laid filter on bench it looked almost perfect, a little push on the top of it and the hole thing literally disintegrated, turned to powder.
They can really ruin your day if they get sucked in, here are pictures I took a while ago to show how bad they are even if they look in one piece. They usually don't survive long enough for my to get the camera out.
Before
After
There are two pieces of foam to clean out of the double air cleaner, I find one piece of new pre-filter is usually enough in both types (this may vary depending on type of foam you use).
David
P.S. I find similar disintegrating old foam in the vintage electronics I repair, I had to replace some yesterday in a HP voltmeter from the 1970's (used to either keep circuit boards in place, or prevent vibration being transferred to certain parts, such as some vacuum tubes).
I meant to add these last night but got distracted.
Here are parts which look to be for holding the trimmer head on, I'm missing the shaft that goes between the 201254 shaft part and the PTO shaft on the engine. Part 400642 is a cap that fits on the end of this second shaft which has internal spring clips.
And here are the parts that make up the air cleaner assembly, the first two parts 87-4 & 122-1 were previously used as exhaust parts, part 200946 is a modified version of the standard air cleaner part without the raised edge (see comparison with standard part) and the last part is a typical fixing rod for the air cleaner assembly (minus nuts & washers).
And the last part is the complete trigger cable assembly part 400611, I've no idea if there are different lengths of this for the various models of string trimmers they made, I put the loose parts on the end of the cable, they look to be fitted & soldered during assembly.
David
P.S. there are a few more small parts, a bronze bearing, various spacers & fixings that I haven't pictured yet, not even sure if they are for these.
Here is what I said around 12 months ago when someone asked about the value of a Tiny Tiger, along with certain chainsaws they are very common, remember to check recent sold prices/completed listings, but be very careful with "buy-it-now" items as ePay hide the actual lower sold price if "best offer" was used.
I'm not sure a refurbished one would sell for more than a nice clean original one, it all depends on the amount of people interested at the time of selling and what they are prepared to pay.
David
On 5/25/2019 at 1:05 PM, factory said:
Welcome to the forum Alex and thanks for posting pictures of your Tiny Tiger.
It looks like it maybe the very common Model 300 (the band around the generator with these details is missing), these don't make anywhere near that (where did you get the 350 figure from?) as they were very popular in the 1960's and so many have survived.
From your pictures I can see the condenser needs a repair, the spark-plug lead reattaching and the cylinder side plate is missing, also I can't tell if the primer button is missing from the carb or if the carb has one of the top covers without this.
Model 300 Tiny Tiger generators in this condition typically make around $75 to $125. Rarer models with the larger tank and boxed like new ones can make around $200 to $250 or sometimes more dependant on the number of interested buyers at the time.
Here is a current screen-grab of completed listings on eBay.com, even that very nice condition complete Tiny Tiger with paperwork only made $138.
Hope this helps with the value and I'm sorry if it seems a lot lower than you thought.
).
Ohlsson & Rice: Chip-A-Saw Gets a New Life...
in Ohlsson and Rice
Posted
Looks very nice, well done.
David